Vets!!!!

[Grace Erick]

I don't mean to start this thread for vet bashing, but as informative info for some dog owners. It sure is a slippery slope for some new dog owners and older ones with new dog issues regarding illnesses and whether they trust their vet or feel they are either unexperienced in what you are bringing your dog in for or are bill building.

I have heard so many negative stories about vets. I don't know what the percentages are in terms of vets who build bills and those who don't.

I do know they love to sell their prescription food like Eukanuba, Science Diet, and IVD, which can be exchanged for better brands that achieve the same results.

It has has been said and I read an article entitled, "Why do vets sell Science Diet". The ugly answer is they get perks from these companies and the vets are really not trained in dog nutrition or what dog foods are available. I would not write off my vet if he or she suggested these products. They may still be good vets, but feel compelled to sell this junk.

My vet's technician pushed blood tests for heartworm and to put my dog on heartworm meds when we don't have this problem in my state. That is why I think it is important to interface with each other and share information so that we can make informed decisions even though our vets do have a big 8 years of schooling.

It's a shame to have to do so much research on what your dog's problem is to make sure your vet is treating your dog correctly, but that is the way it is sometimes. It really is the same for us with our doctors so I guess we should not be too surprised that we should double check our vets and get 2nd opinions in some cases.

Bye, Grace

[Andre Mendizabal]

I went through 4 vets until I found one I could trust, and who wouldn't take my money for nothing!!! My previous dog, a mini-schnauzer, was a really sick little doggie and I had to take him really often to the vet, there were some vets that gave him prescription drugs for the wrong problem, others that made me do x-rays, lab tests, etc., for small problems like worms... Anyway, I finally found the one I go now, he's reliable, he's not after my money and he really looks like if he cares about he animals, its the first one my older dog, Molly, has felt comfortable with (she's a shy and nervous little girl). However he does sell Science Diet and Eukanuba, but he told me he's no pet nutritionist, but he would not recommend either of those foods, if I wanted to buy them it was ok, if not, it was ok too. He has a good practice and the only reason I know he sells those foods its because there's a pet-shop in his office too and well, we don't have that huge variety to choose from. Anyway, its hard to get a vet you can trust, but there are some good ones out there, its just a matter of looking :D

[Dave Kersh]

My vet's technician pushed blood tests for heartworm and to put my dog on heartworm meds when we don't have this problem in my state.

This is from The American Heartworm Society:

"Canine heartworm infection is widely distributed throughout the United States. Heartworm infection has been found in dogs native to all 50 states. All dogs regardless of their age, sex, or habitat are susceptible to heartworm infection."

Here's the link: http://www.heartwormsociety .org/CanineHeartwormInfo. htm

While the article goes on to say that some areas of the country have fewer instances of heartworms than others, do you really want to take the chance that your new neighbor from Mississippi has been diligently giving his dogs heartworm preventative? It only takes one mosquito...

[Luciann]

i have had the same thing with vets. I have finally found one that i like and trust, but neither of my babies like going to the vet, they don't mind the vet herself or her husband they just are afraid that i will leave them there

[Grace Erick]

Dave, this is a heartworm map, and it shows along with another heartworm map I saw that there is no heartworm where I live. None of the Chihuahua Club show dog people give their show dogs heartworm meds either.

I did read that a chart can show heartworm sometimes when it really is not a problem in your area due to someone bringing dogs with them from heartworm areas when they move or traveled in heartworm areas and returned with it.

What's nice about this map is that is shows when heartworm may be present in your area where some vets may want to put your pet on heartworm meds year round.

I also use mosquito medicine in our warmest months just so that mosquitos don't bite her but it's not to protect her from heartworm, plus it protects her from fleas and ticks.

Bye, Grace

[Grace Erick]

Yep, old age has set in:) Here is the link for the heartworm map. If someone wants to use this, it's best to read the info, because I believe they suggest giving the meds one month prior to heartworm problems and two months after.

http://www.citadeltm.com/Heartworm.html

Bye, Grace

[Grace Erick]

I figured I may as well post that other heartworm map which I had done already on another thread. Click on the colored map to enlarge it and see where heartworm is prevalent.

http://cal.vet.upenn.edu/merial/hrtworm/hw_3.htm

Bye, Grace

[Dave Kersh]

Grace, you don't say where you are, but in the first set of maps I don't see any area of the country where it suggests that you don't need to protect your dog at all. The second link states that heartworms are geographically limited but does not rule out the possibility of heartworms existing in any state.
I'm not trying to be contentious, but heartworms are very dangerous and I always like to err on the side of caution.
We took the baby in yesterday for a round of puppy shots and there was a couple who had just lost their dog to heartworms. They were carrying him out as we came in. It's very sad when a preventable disease kills a dog.

[Grace Erick]

Dave, I know you are warning me as the severity of heartworm. I have seen what damage it causes by going to a chihuahua rescue site where so many of the dogs come in with heartworm (but not from my state) and it's so hard to treat once infected. I appreciate your warning.

I'm in Washington state, and on the map, there is a "V" in the middle of the state which is the Puget Sound and I live kind of in the middle of that "V" on the right side of the map. With heartworm seeming to be non existent where I live, I would not give my dog heartworm meds that have many side effects and can be fatal unless I really saw a need for it.

The weather here does not support heartworm problems unless you live south or east where the climate is drastically different. It's hot and dessert like in some areas.

I have a peculiar wonderful climate where I live. It rarely reaches 35 degrees in the winter; it's more like 45-50 degrees and the summer temps are like spring with 70-80 degree days, so the days and nights can be cool and don't support heartworm larvae growth. A dog can be bitten by misquitos, but they can't transmit heartworm unless the weather is a a certain degree for 30 days. We have mosquitos here all year since we don't usually get a first frost to kill them, so those months where people have mosquitos in colder weather, their dogs cannot get heartworm even if bitten. That is my understanding from everything I have read. Heartworm larvae need warm weather to exist.

I've discussed this issue with many chihuahua breeders who have been breeding for over 30 years and they don't give heartworm meds to their show dogs or their pet dogs.

Bye, Grace

[Missy Stewart]

HW preventative is an interesting topic. What it actually does is sweep through your dogs system killing off any of the microfilaria that "might" be present. So regardless of whether or not your dog is infected, it is getting a dose of the poison (ivermectin). I only use HW preventative in the warm months of summer. And even then I do not give it monthly. There are many reasons behind why I chose not to use it monthly. One is that the poisons used in these pills (if used religiously every month) have been shown to cause liver damage in some animals. Ivermectin has also been linked to seizures, paralysis, nerve damage, pneumonia, aggression, skin eruptions, tremors and sudden death (just to name a few).

Diethylcarbamazine is another drug used in HW preventative and has somewhat less of an effect by causing headache, weakness, and joint pains, loss of appetite, nausea, vomiting, and eruptions of the scrotum.

Also, a report by the American Veterinary Medical Association on adverse drug reactions showed that 65% of all drug reactions reported and 48% of all deaths caused by drug reactions were a result of HW PREVENTATIVE.

Dr. Pitcairn in his book Natural Health Care for Cats and Dogs points out that wild animals (such as coyotes) thrive in the same infested conditions as our domesticated dogs without these preventative drugs (they are NOT succumbing to HW at the rate of our own companion animals). What does he attribute this to? Fresh raw food, plenty of exercise, and NO drugs/preventatives or toxic flea products!

If you really feel uncomfortable not using "preventative"... According to Don Hamilton, DVM it is safe to use the preventative at 7-8 week intervals vs. the every 4 weeks instructed by your local vet. Yet he does caution that HW preventative is prone to causing autoimmune disease in pets (which includes thyroid disease). Also, if you check your pet every 6 months for microfilaria, the dose of drugs used to kill the baby worms will not be any more than if you had given preventative all along. They key is in having the test preformed EVERY 6 months!!!!

In some ways I believe that our society has become too wrapped up in this idea of "prevention." I always hear people comment on how it is "not worth the risk" not to follow the exact vaccine regimes, HW/flea/tick programs given by vets. But what we are failing to realize is that by CONSTANTLY bombarding our pets systems with foreign materials, we are suppressing the immune system and actually making our pets weaker as a species and more vulnerable.

I'm not trying to get off of topic, but the few documented cases where humans have been given annual shots, each and every one died before the age of 30 from some sort of "vaccinosis" related diseases.

Need an example? In 1796 Edward Jenner, and English Doctor, observed that dairymaids who contracted a minor disease called cowpox did not seem to succumb to the scourge of smallpox. He took a sample of the diseased skin from one of the maids and applied it to the arm of a healthy 8 year old boy named James Phipps. The experiment worked, the boy contracted cowpox, but when subjected to smallpox did not sucumb to it. In his enthusiasm, Jenner revaccinated the boy 20 times. At the age of 20, he died from tuberculosis. Jenner also re-vaccinated his own son repeatedly until he did at the age of 21 from tuberculosis also. Coincidence? Maybe?

How about another example? The petussis vaccine among humans became available in the 1940's. The first case of autism also became known around the same time. Both in the US and in Europe, the rise in autism nealry matched the widening use of the pertussis vaccine. Coincidence? The Author of Vaccines: Are They Really Safe? reports in his book that autism was once considered a disease only among the wealthy children of educated parents. As a result, the disease was viewed as most likely a result of high genetic inteligence. Yet during the 1970's, the disease grew to affect all socioeconomic classes. And non-coicidentaly, the mass distribution of the pertussis vaccine was matching the increase in reported autism cases.

I could go on for hours with examples! It is really frusterating! And there is far less precaution taken with the vaccines and drugs used with our animals than the precautions taken with human vaccines and prevention! Now that is scary!

So why in the heck are we putting our pets through this? Is it so that the pharmaceutical companies and our veterinarians can make a killing off of our vulnerability. It just makes me sick!

[Dave Kersh]

65% of all drug reactions reported and 48% of all deaths caused by drug reactions were a result of HW PREVENTATIVE.
I'm very interested in reading this study, but I can't find a link on the AVMA site. The only heartworm information I can find there advocates preventatives.
I'm particularly interested in seeing how many cases of drug reactions were reported and how many of the adverse reactions occurred in dogs already infected with heartworms. A percentage is not very useful unless you know the total number and other mitigating circumstances.
Again, I'm not trying to be contentious but I can't find any actual research online to dissuade me from giving my dogs heartworm preventative. I've found much anecdotal evidence, but no hard facts based on research.
BTW, I have Aussies so my dogs aren't on Ivermectin.
So why in the heck are we putting our pets through this? Is it so that the pharmaceutical companies and our veterinarians can make a killing off of our vulnerability.
Personally, I use hearworm preventative because I live in Texas and I don't want my dogs to die a slow, agonizing death.

[Missy Stewart]

I did not get any of this info online. The study that I quoted was from Dr. Pitcairns book Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs and Cats . The other sources that I used included The Nature of Animal Healing by Dr. Martin Goldstein as well as Dr. Hamiltons book Homeopathic Care for Cats and Dogs.

The point that I am getting at is that it is absolutely absurb to reccomend giving HW preventative year round in areas that expereince the 4 seasons! It is nothing more than a ploy to bring in revenue for vets and the pharmaceuticals. It baffles me that people actually think that there is enough risk in the winter months of contracting HW that is it worth subjecting your pet to the drug. A minimum enviromental temperature of 57 degrees must exist for a minimum of two weeks (day and night) for the microfilaria to survive. Therefore, dogs cannot get in the winter, and most likely late fall or early spring (depending on the climate you live in)!

Like I said before, for the area that I live, it is only necesary to give it a few times a year. I also test every 6 months. The people with dying dogs that you see have been infected for at LEAST a year or more. If you catch it early (within 6 months of infection), again, the treatment is no more harsh than if you had been giving preventative all along.

[Grace Erick]

Dave, I met a chihuahua breeder online who lived in TX and did heartworm prevention, but when she moved here (in WA), the new vet said it was not necessary anymore. It sounds hard to believe that my vet would put my chi on meds for heartworm when it's not necessary, but some like to bill builds. It also meant charging me $55 for a blood test for heartworm before she was put on the meds.

Bye, Grace

[Missy Stewart]

Personally, I use heartworm preventative because I live in Texas and I don't want my dogs to die a slow, agonizing death.

You are really missing the point here... Grace lives in an area that experiences hard winters and mild summers. There are FAR LESS months in her calendar year where her dog would be at risk vs. yours. I understand you not wanting your dogs to die a slow, painful death. No one wants that. All I am saying is use some logic with this. If you have temps consistent with what is needed for HW YEAR ROUND, than by all means use it if that is what you choose to do. If I were you, I will still only give it every 7-8 weeks and test every 6 months, but that is just my take on it. The more I can keep toxins out of my dog’s body, the better.

Picture this for a minute...
Imagine if you had to take a poisonous pill once a month. Had pesticides dumped on your back for fleas/ticks, ate a highly processed diet containing the minimal nutrition needed for your survival, and also got shot up with a multi-vac for measels/mumbs/rubella and tetanus every year. How do you think you would feel??? It is exactly what we are doing to our dogs. And then we wonder why they are dying of cancer at alarming rates. As well as succumbing too many other degenerative diseases. We have become so drug happy as a society. Eventually we are going to pay for what we are doing to our bodies and our pets. The key is moderation; I believe that things are getting out of control.

[Mickelle Weber]

I have been through 3 vets and still have not found one that doesn't JUSTwant my money! The most recent was a vet that my trainer recommended. She told me stories of how this vet checked for the more simple reason for problems instead of just off the bat recommending blood work and an MRI. So when Cleo was throwing up and sleeping all day they recommended I bring her in immedietly!! I rushed her there and waited for an hour and then the doctor came in, recommended blood work and possibly an MRI for a possible seizure!! i was shocked and told her i would need to give it some thought. we took her home and gave her some nutra cal and hand fed her food and the next day she was almost herself. i called the vet to see what they thought and they said that she may have gotten into something(ie poisened)...why didn't they think of this when we were sitting in their office??? I ended up calling in with one other question and the nurse hurried me off the phone and never really answered my question!! So i paid another $35 to diagnose cleo myself!! I know that it is always a good idea to be more safe that sorry, but I just feel that there is not a good vet in my area!!
This is a very frustrating subject for me(and sadly sounds like i'm not the only one!) Thanks for listening Y'all!!

[Grace Erick]

Michelle,

I ask around my neighborhood, but no one seems real happy with their vet. I did have a vet, but left him for not seeing my dog who was crying, 15 minutes to them closing and I live 5 min away amongst other things. He is practicing for 20 years but could not diagnose Capri's "backward sneeze" which is something a lot of chis and other small dogs do, so I left with no answer about my dog's seemingly gasping for air.

My new vet that did Capri's dental cleaning seemed good, so I'm sticking with him.

Bye, Grace

[Kendall Aliza]

My vets office has three DVMs that are not assigned to one particular dog. You can schedule your appt so that you can see the particular doctor that you want to see, but you always have ask who is in on what times, ect,. Believe it or not, I like all three of the DVMs there but because they are so busy I'll spend 40 mins waiting in the lobby, 40 mins in the room, 10 mins with the doctor and then they'll rush out the door. It is frustrating because though I realize he/she probably has sicker dogs to see(possibly), I often end up feeling confused about everything that went on. I have been thinking about switching since I last went in with Shaddy. I particularly love one doctor, he put me down for a recheck several times when he couldve easily charged me for an office visit, he also didnt charge me for xrays that came out a little off, and is just very honest about what he is capable of... But just a month ago I was in the middle of talking/wrapping things up and I am notice him inching to the door. He, of course, apologized for having to go and saying they were busy but that just isnt good enough. So I dont know...

[Dave Kersh]

You are really missing the point here... Grace lives in an area that experiences hard winters and mild summers. There are FAR LESS months in her calendar year where her dog would be at risk vs. yours.
With all due respect, I don't think I'm missing the point at all. Grace said her dogs are not on HW preventative at all. I simply stated that the maps she linked did not show any areas of the country where heartworms don't exist. I have never advocated HW preventative year-round in climates where it's not mandated, but I do advocate HW preventative in all areas of the country when the climate is conducive to their growth. We rarely stay under 57 degrees for more than two weeks at a time and my dogs are on HW preventative to keep them from getting HW, not to line a vets pockets.
Imagine if you had to take a poisonous pill once a month. Had pesticides dumped on your back for fleas/ticks, ate a highly processed diet containing the minimal nutrition needed for your survival, and also got shot up with a multi-vac for measels/mumbs/rubella and tetanus every year. How do you think you would feel??? It is exactly what we are doing to our dogs.
When you call HW preventative "poison" and insinuate that the majority of vets in this country have more concern for their wallets than the animals they treat, I think you may scare some people away from doing what's best for their pets. I think it's more prudent to offer hard evidence based on clinical research and allow folks to choose based on fact and not emotion. I treat my dogs with HW preventative. I vaccinate based on where my dogs go and how much contact they have with unknown animals. I feed California Natural dog food. I do the best I can for my dogs based on the scientific facts that are available. I found a vet that I trust (doesn't charge me for every office visit; euthanised my cat with kidney failure for free, etc.) and I follow the plan that he suggests. I don't pretend to know what others should do and I would never suggest that what someone else's vet says is wrong. I only suggested that Grace might reconsider treating her dogs if the climatic conditions are right. That's all...

[Grace Erick]

Hi,

I don't mean to laugh at your problem, but it was funny how you said the vet was inching his way towards the door, lol:) They should not go anywhere near the door if you are not satisfied, and have more questions. Afterall, we know that most times you cannot not talk with the vet once you leave.

That sure is a lot of waiting time. I usually don't wait too long, but your vets seem to book clients like human doctors where they always run behind and tend to overbook. I wonder if you booked an end of the day appt. if they would linger since there were no more patients waiting, but end of the day appts are hard to come by since everyone gets off of work and want those same appts. It would be a shame to leave a vets or at least some of them that you like.

I got a message on my dental cleaning bill saying Capri was a good patient and I suppose that referred to when she was under anesthesia, because when the vet came for her and went to grab her quickly, she went to nip at him, lol. He was NOT disturbed by it, especially since he knew she would be very docile under anesthesia in a few minutes:) They sent her home wearing this cute orange print neckerchief. I was suprised he spoke with me on the phone later in the week about why her two teeth he pulled were loose.

Bye, Grace

[Colleen]

I just want to put a :tup: for my vet. I took my little girl in after her fixing surgery and I was concerned for no reason. He took the stitches out, gave me some encouragement, and didn't charge me for the visit. He knows I will come to him when I need him and if there is something that NEEDS to be done, he will do it.

[Amber]

Being that I live in Louisiana, I do have to say that I agree with Dave in the fact that, at least he and I, have to treat our dogs year round. Luckily, I too found a great vet (actually two, they work in the same building) that Sally LOVES! Precious loves everyone she meets, so...lol

Anyway...the vet(s) I use are the Petsmart vet, otherwise known as Banfield. They are the two greatest vets I have ever met since getting Precious and Sally. My previous vet before these two charged me for over $100 more than he should have for Sally's demodectic mange treatment, when it turns out she didn't even HAVE it anymore! The Banfield vets checked her and deemed her "cured" after two negative skin scrapings. The other vet was just going to keep telling me he saw "just one mite" without telling me if it was dead or alive until he took all my money! ARRGG!! Sally used to hate the vets office, peeing and pooping as soon as I took her out of her crate, but now that I switched she comes out and loves to get petted, etc! If I'm not happy with my bill, they'll even take off some...I'm not talking $10 or anything. Up to date, they have taken $100 off my bill and I've only been there 3 times. That really helps since I'm a college student! lol

[Grace Erick]

Amber, wow!!!! You sure do have nice vets. I don't expect to pay less, but it's nice they recognize you are a student and are probably glad you rescued a dog and want to help. Not every vet would be so kind, especially if they are part of a huge company like Banfield. Maybe it's part of the southern hospitality you have down there:) The chi rescue in my state does have a vet that charges less for when they bring in rescue dogs.

I know there are good stories out there, but it seems there are so many bad ones. Maybe it's because we tend to talk about bad experiences more? I didn't start this topic to bash vets but to make people aware they need to do research to make sure their vets are doing the right thing and perhaps get 2nd opinions sometimes and to check out what anesthesia will be used on their dogs and what pain meds and what tests need to be done.

My east coast friend had her vet charge her over $1,230. and hospitalized her dog for 3 days for a seizure or two that she had. They still want to do more tests and have no answers for her a month later. I really don't think hospitilization was necessary. I felt so bad they did some bill building, because she said she later found out her dog just needed a $100 test. She isn't on this site, so I can say, I don't think she really had the extra money, but felt compelled to comply with whatever they wanted done, because she did not know any better at that time. I'm sure she must have been so scared when her dog had the seizure.

Bye, Grace

[Missy Stewart]

I actually really like Sonny's current vet. She is a holistic vet (who also uses allopathic medicine), and since Sonny reacts to EVERYTHING, she has tried very hard to find alternative ways in treating him. She calls him her little wonder dog :wink: She has also been really good about not slapping on unnecessary charges and expenses. Which has been nice since I am student and broke most of the time.

Sonny's first vet was a completely different story though! He wanted to put my 4 month old dog on steroid shots for the allergies that he had developed. When I asked him if there were any other alternatives, he said no. According to him, my only choice was to use cortisone shots and a special prescription diet for the rest of his life :rolleyes: It was such a frustrating experience! Luckily I found Sonny's current vet shortly afterwards, and he is doing great WITHOUT any synthetic medications. In fact, all I did was switch him to a raw diet. All of the "un-curable" problems went away. His vet was absolutely floored at the level of his improvement in such a short period of time.

Unfortunately we will have to find a new vet by this time next year because we are moving! And even though I am beyond ELATED at the idea of living in downtown Chicago, I am not looking forward to weeding through the vets until I find someone that I like. Not to mention the fact that they are going to be SO MUCH more expensive there... is anyone on this site from that area that could recommend someone????? I would really appreciate it!!!

[Amber]

Grace,

Also, I think part of the reason is that they know the person I volunteer for and yes, because I adopted a dog from her. Not only because I adopted just a dog, but because I adopted a dog with so many problems and they fell IN LOVE with her when I walked in the door with her! I really do love them though. When Sally first came in and they could tell she was nervous, instead of sticking the thermometer in her butt, they put it in her ear...just little things like that that really helped her like her vets. It also helped that both vets are female and the other vet was a male...Sally HATES men!

[Grace Erick]

Amber, she is adorable too and seems so fragile from your description of her being timid. You feel protective over those dogs.

Hey!!!! They have an ear thermometer and they've been using the butt one on my dog? I'm going to have to look into this on my next visit which I hope is a long time from now:)

Bye, Grace

[Kimberly Lyons]

Wow Amber Im glad that you have had such great luck with Banfeild, because the Banfeild that I went to sucked. I took my (then) seven month old GSD to the vet for his shots. He was underweight when I bought him at five months old, but otherwise he was in good health. He just needed to gain about five pounds and he was eating the proper amounts for a puppy and GSD, I was also at the time continuing to feed him on the raw diet that he was on when I purchased him, until I could find a brand of dog food that I was happy with.

This vet was rude and obnoxious, he was unreasonable and just mean. He interupeted me several times and told me his opionion was the only right opinion. I hadnt been to a vet before and this was flooring, I unfortunately did not tell him what I thought of him and left without comment. But they lost a good customer that day. Fourtuately I have found a good vet that I take my dogs to now and there is an after hours emergency vet that is o.k.

The vet at Banfeild asked me what I was feeding him, after I told him that he was on the raw diet, he imediataly started in on how bad it was, he asked me why I put him on the diet and I told him it was because he was on it when I got him and I kept him on it because of the breeder recommendation and I didnt want to have to go through changing the dry food. He iterupted me as I was telling him this and asked me several times if the breeder had a degree in nutrition. After I said no he recommended that I switch him to one of the brands Petsmart was selling. I didnt think to ask if he had a degree either but Im pretty sure he didnt.

[Grace Erick]

Apparently it depends on the vet you get at Banfield. Kimberly, yours was about the worst I've heard yet. When I had an emergency and went there, they took me at closing time, and the vet was good, didn't want to perform tests even though she could not find what was wrong with my dog and said if I did tests, it would probably turn up nothing.

Some people feel they are this big money making business, but aren't they all, even the private ones telling you to buy their Eukanuba and Science Diet food? Gee, your Banfield vet was real rude! I don't think he realizes you are paying him for a service and not to be abused or hear his opinion. Everyone has an opinion; I prefer to hear facts from the vet.

Bye, Grace

[Lesly Stevens]

I feel that a vet has to be carefully selected, just as we choose our own physicians. And, we have to become informed. Thankfully, the internet provides a wealth of information, though one has to consider the source.

I scheduled an appointment to meet my vet (who was reccommended by two people who are like-minded), and discussed my needs, concerns, views on vaccinations, and, most important, what his expertise was in diagnosing and dealing with the genetic diseases my breed was predisposed to, along with bloat - surgical preventive surgery, in addition to emergency reactive surgery .

Medical doctors are wined and dined (and a whole lot more) by drug company sales reps. They may not know squat about a lot of what they're prescribing, and you have to hope your pharmacist knows the score, and doesn't make mistakes! Question what you're getting and why. Nutrition? Hah! The same is true for vets. But, they deserve a good living just like everyone else, and they are highly skilled doctors who had to pay a lot of money to get their education. Yes, they sell Science Diet out've their office, but I'm not stupid enough to buy that crap! Yes, many good vets still push annual vaccinations, and do it with 5-in-one or even 7-in-one shots, but I'm not stupid enough to go along with it!

People often complain about the cost for veterinary care, but when we decide to make the committment to adding a pet to the family, we need to take this into consideration. Being proactive is a huge part in keeping our pets healthy. If one doesn't protect against Heartworm, then no one is to blame for the cost of the cure except the person who chose to risk it. Too bad the dog is the one who really pays. It's expensive to have a pet! I about freaked when I realized just how much I was paying out each month just in food ($200 +) and grooming ($130 +) alone! Yikes! I have two Standard Poodles. I deliberately selected Maddy as a 9 wk. old puppy, and knew full well what supporting her would cost me. Bo was unexpected. A rescue who was clearly not going to make it if he remained where he was, and would require a great deal of patience and hard work. I took him home with me, and have prayed ever since! LOL! The fact is, I go without many things I want, but Bo is worth it. Should a veterinary emergency arise, I know my vet will work with me on a payment schedule.

My vet got single dose, single vaccines (hard to find, by the way), given at least one month apart, and never in combination with other vaccines, or when being neutered/spayed, and only given when healthy. He respected my decision about vaccinating, and we've had many discussions over the years about protocol, questionable drugs, and so on. He adores my dogs (he must, or he wouldn't kiss them on the mouth! LOL!), and is always willing to work with me financially (you wouldn't believe how many feral cats I've brought to him to be spayed or neutered!). He's earned my trust, not only through his vast knowlege, but also because he's open and receptive, and willing to admit he doesn't know. (He's nice to look at, too. Wink wink.)

Lesly, Maddy, & Bo

[Melissa Brunoehler]

Hi Missy~

And even though I am beyond ELATED at the idea of living in downtown Chicago, I am not looking forward to weeding through the vets until I find someone that I like. Not to mention the fact that they are going to be SO MUCH more expensive there... is anyone on this site from that area that could recommend someone????? I would really appreciate it

I have finally found a vet that uses alternative treatments & has her own location (rather than working out of someone else's clinic.) Lewie has his first appointment tonight. She is located in the NW suburbs of chicago. If you're willing to drive out of the city and would like more info on the vet, let me know.

[Missy Stewart]

Wow, that would be wonderful. We will be keeping one car, so it would be possible to drive out of town. What suburb is it in?

[Melissa Brunoehler]

Hi~

She is located in Barrington Hills - 30 miles NW of Chicago. I might reschedule Lewie's appointment for tonight (he has class). But I'll send you a PM after our 1st appointment.

Wow, that would be wonderful. We will be keeping one car, so it would be possible to drive out of town. What suburb is it in?

[Missy Stewart]

That would be great!! Thank you !!!! :-P

[Melissa Brunoehler]

No Problem. His appointment is tonight at 5:30. The initial visit is a little costly, the vet performs a chiropractic adjustment & acupuncture among other things including whatever you're there for. The receptionist was very nice & when I mentioned Lewie is a Rescue & submissive urinates at the vet she reassured me that the Doctor works with a lot of rescues & she will go as slow as necessary. I'll fill you in tomorrow....

That would be great!! Thank you !!!! :-P

[Karen Kwei]

Allow me to whine over my bad experience when i brought my mutt for sterlization three years ago! The bad experience is still imprinted in my mind. First, i made an appointment and i arrived there promptly and yet i had to wait there for an hour before the vet will see my dog.. :rolleyes: Then the vet was giving Russell an examination and then he demanded that Russell be muzzled. Well, no problem i had him muzzled tight. Halfway, through the examination, HE SQUIRMED and said the muzzle is coming loose! I had my dog under control...

That is not the worse. He said that i had no idea what i am feeding and strongly recommended Science Diet. At that point, i was feeding Russell home cooked food with fresh chicken and mutton and brown rice and fish oils with loads of variety. I just said i will consider. Obviously Russell was scared as he is not used to being touched all over by a stranger and the vet was asking, IS HE A STRAY? and the vet was trying to sell me more and more supplements instead and telling me the cost of each! :confused:

The saddest part was that i feel that he discrimnates mutts because in Singapore, mutts are a less priliveged bunch. Well, obviously, i never went there again.

Now i go to a vet who is much farther from my home. At least, she does not demand for Russell to be muzzled and Russell likes her. The vet has good bedside manners as well and will describe the problem and will explain to me. Of cos, due to time constraint, if i dun understand, she will reccomend some books for me to read up on. Thumbs up for that vet! :-P

[Grace Erick]

I brought my dog in to a new vet in NY when I was visiting there since Capri got diarreah and he had this big guy hold her like she was a threat. I was upset and told him he had no reason to worry about giving her a standard exam. She is 3-1/2 pounds!!!

Oh brother! I am so tired of vets and their Science Diet!!!! You definitely were feeding your dog better with home made foods. The only thing you have to do is know what the right percentages of meat to rice and/or veggies you have to feed to make a balanced diet. Nutrition books recommend vitamins too since home made foods are not complete. They recommend vitamins meant for home diets which may be more potent since if you feed commercial food, they do meet the minimum standards.

One side note: It's important to make sure the fish oil does not contain mercury. Some people use human grade fish oil, but you still have to make sure it's a good brand.

It's good to share vets stories so that we can learn how to deal with vets or determine if they are good or not.

Bye, Grace

[Stefie C]

Ok, here's my vet horror story. About 15 years ago we had a black lab puppy who began loosing her fur so I took her to the vet we had always used. When I got there I found out the practice had changed hands and now had 3 new vets on staff. They tested the pup, Boomer, for mange. The test came back negative but I was advised this test had a high rate of false neg. and they recommeneded treating for mange anyway. I agreed & they gave her a shot & told me to come back in a week if she wasn't better. I paid them $60 & we left. A week passed and she was no better so back we went. A diff. vet this time but the same diagnosis. Another shot. Another $60. A week later, still no improvement, in fact she was getting worse, so back we go. This time we see the 3rd vet. A young girl fresh out of college and she recommends another shot. I wasn't really comfortable with this but I thought 3 vets all telling me the same thing must be right so agreed to let her give Boomer another shot. When she came back into the room with the syringe she was alone. I told her I'd need some help holding Boomer who was about 9 months old at the time. She laughs at me & says she doesn't need anyone to hold the dog because she was so good & so quick the dog wouln't even know it had had a shot. Okay I say rolling my eyes. So the vet trys to give Boomer a shot and Boomer goes nuts. The vet was thrown to the floor & the needle ended up sticking out of her hand right in the fleshy part between her thumb & pointer finger. She grabbed the syringe out of her hand and threw against the wall all the while cursing me and my dog. I just smiled at her and said ever so sweetly "Well, at least you don't have to worry about getting mange now" :D She just walked out of the room. When she returned with another syringe and three other people to hold Boomer down, I told her I'd changed my mind and no longer trusted her recommendations. She said I'm still gonna charge you. I told her to go ahead & I'd pay her the next time I was in. ;)
After that I took Boomer to a vet my sister recommeneded. This one was a 45 minute drive from us but he took one look at Boomer and said it was allergies. He gave me 3 packets of meds, some ointment and a soothing shampoo and chared me about $25. I can't remember exactly what that 1st vist cost but I do remember whenever she'd have a flare up (every summer) I'd just go & get the meds & they were $7.

[Karen Kwei]

Hi Grace,

I really dislike the Science Diet nonsense. My aunt believed that Science Diet was good cos her vet was endorsing it. Anyway i am now feeding my dog Innova Evo with Karma mixed in it. On weekends, i feed my dog steamed deboned chicken and mutton as well. He is now a happy dog with minimal problems. Hope it stays that way. :-P

In Singapore, we had two infamous vets. There is this vet who alleged burnt a dead cat by mistake. We had another vet who sold vaccines to pet farms and was suspended.