New Rescue and Older Dog

[sibe mom]

To start, I love this site, thanks for all of the information. Now, my problem. 3 days ago we adopted a 3 yr old, male, Siberian Husky; we have no info, other than he was at the shelter for 3.5 weeks. We have a 11 yr old Husky already, and the two are great together, 95% of the time.

The problem comes over food, bones, biscuits etc. Neither one realizes that they each have the same thing, and a fight begins. I have been seperating the two, because I don't want the new one to feel he has to fight for food, so I seperate them to eat. Then, if there are any crumbs left and one makes a move toward them (I don't even see the crumbs all the time) then there is a new fight. Any suggestions?

They also begin fights during what begins as play. They will play, chase each other, wrestle, growl, etc. Then, with no warning, it turns actually viloent, as if one nipped the other too hard or something. I have also broken up these arguments.

As I stated they get along great, except for these few instances but I do not want these situations to get more out of control, so any advice will be appreciated.

Any suggestions for his "territory markings" would be great also, he is house broken, but will leave a few drops here and there as if marking territory.

Thanks in advance.
jeri jones

[heathea]

Good for you for adopting! Congrats!

I am sorry I don't have "the" answer for you, however I know one "trick" is when you are around it to have their leashes on and drag them around so that you can seperate them more easily and are less likely to become damaged...don't leave them dragging if you aren't home to supervise.

Do you have them both on NILIF? If not, I would start. It will show them you are in charge, and maybe the squabbling will slow down.

Also you can stop giving them the things they fight over, it may seem cruel to take away all the toys and bones, but it is better for them to work for those anyway. My husband always laughs at me when I try to reason with the dogs that they both have the same thing, he always tells me (and he is correct) that whatever bone the other dog has is "the bone of contention". It just is.


As for that "fun" little marking trick, the only thing that ever worked for my friends who had a dog with this problem was a belly band (boy peeing only diaper). You just wash them. It doesn't solve the problem, but marking is a tough one, so it would keep you from continually cleaning up in the meantime. I know you can find them on ebay and various other places.

I hope this helped a little, sorry I can't help more.
good luck!
-Heather

[Melissa Brunoehler]

Hi Jeri~

I'm going to assume that neither dog has injured the other one. If that is not the case let me know as I'll have different advise for you.

Heather has given you some suggestions & I'd like to add a few more-

If playing turns "violent" you need to make sure you are always supervising these guys. Make sure they are getting exercise one at a time, like a leash walk. When you are not home they need to be seperated in crates or in seperate rooms.

When you are home & they do start playing, let them play for a little bit, but stop them before it goes bad. I tell my guys to "take a break" , not b/c they start to fight but because they're big & my house is small. Anyway interupt their playing & allow them to have a breather from one another. If you need to put one out side with an awesome treat/toy & play a quick game with the other. Just be sure to stop the play before they're at each other. I'd rather that they play for only 30 seconds then play for 5 minutes & start fighting. If you don't feel comfortable with this, don't let them play at all.

Make sure all toys are picked up. Only give toys/treats if the dog has earned it by doing what you request(sit, down, etc). And only give treats/toys when the dogs are completely seperated. Give small treats so that there are no crumbs and do not let one dog go check for crumbs.

As for the marking- I would treat your pup like a puppy that isn't house trained. Which means you need to watch him constantly. When he looks like he's going to mark (you'll need to learn the signs if you can't already tell) tell him come one! let's go outside! When he does any sort of potty outside reward him with praise & a treat.

I think with NILIF, supervision, management & one on one time with each pup you can help your dogs. BUT if you feel overwhelmed or that things are getting worse please contact a professional behaviorist or trainer.

If you have any other questions, please ask

To start, I love this site, thanks for all of the information. Now, my problem. 3 days ago we adopted a 3 yr old, male, Siberian Husky; we have no info, other than he was at the shelter for 3.5 weeks. We have a 11 yr old Husky already, and the two are great together, 95% of the time.

The problem comes over food, bones, biscuits etc. Neither one realizes that they each have the same thing, and a fight begins. I have been seperating the two, because I don't want the new one to feel he has to fight for food, so I seperate them to eat. Then, if there are any crumbs left and one makes a move toward them (I don't even see the crumbs all the time) then there is a new fight. Any suggestions?

They also begin fights during what begins as play. They will play, chase each other, wrestle, growl, etc. Then, with no warning, it turns actually viloent, as if one nipped the other too hard or something. I have also broken up these arguments.

As I stated they get along great, except for these few instances but I do not want these situations to get more out of control, so any advice will be appreciated.

Any suggestions for his "territory markings" would be great also, he is house broken, but will leave a few drops here and there as if marking territory.

Thanks in advance.
jeri jones

[David Crandall]

I agree with everything Heather said. Be really careful breaking up the fights. When they're really going at it, they can clamp down on you before they realize it's you.

We had similar problems with our elkhounds fighting (one was the clear instigator in that case). If you search through my posts (there aren't many of them) you can find lots of details of what we've dealt with; I just don't have the energy to go through and type it all again right now.
I would never let them alone with each other.

Is it possible that the "marking" you're talking about is either submission peeing or excitement peeing? We've seen both of those happen in our situation.

We still have to keep the separated most of the time, but now we can at least walk them together. At this point we've had them together for 2.5 years, and they still can't be left alone (we had a near fight just last night). We still feed them separately, and they are never alone together.

Be very careful about going through doors. The more dominant dog has the "right" to go through first. If they each feel that they should be that dog, this can lead to some really vicious fights.

Until you have this under control, I wouldn't let them play with each other anymore at all. It's possible you'll never get them to do it again. Each time that turns into a fight, it will make them on a shorter fuse for the next time they're together. Learn from our mistake. We didn't recognize this, and, when things were at their worst, our dogs got to the point where they would attack if they just got within a few feet of each other. You need to break the cycle before it gets to that point.

Dave

[Deb Rompen]

Hi Jeri, I'm new to doggiebag and you're my first post - I hope I can give you some useful info.

It's possible the problem is the pecking order has been disrupted with the new arrival. Your older dog has been second only to you - now there's a new kid on the block. Is it possible your older dog feels he's being pushed down the totem pole? Try feeding your dogs at separate times, not just away from each other. Make sure the older dog gets fed first and keep Junior away from him at this time. Same with treats, toys, etc. Dogs don't have much sense about "fair and equal" but they do understand pecking order and food is probably the number one issue for them. As for marking, well, boys will be boys. Did your older dog "mark" before Junior came in? This could be another sign that the pecking order has been inadvertently upset. As for "playing" that turns to "fighting" your older dog may be trying to put Junior in his place. "Playful" biting, nipping, growling etc. is the way and superior dog will put a junior dog in his place - if Junior doesn't pay heed things can get hairy. Try the feeding thing first - since food is one of the top issues in the pecking order if that gets settled down the rest may follow. I agree with the others, too, a chat with your vet or a trainer could only help. Good Luck and thanks for adopting a rescue.

Deb and Molly

[sibe mom]

Thanks for all the advice. Nikita (the 11 year old) and Ivan (the new one) are settling down a bit.

I am feeding them around the corner from each other so that has helped with meal times. As far as the bones, well, he has just recently shown interest in chewing so I want him to have a specific item to chew. Nikita will leave him alone now with the bone.

Ivan is also understanding Nikita's low "leave me alone" growl and will stay away from her at the moment. So, maybe part of this is just the two of them going through an initial 'getting to know each other' period. They do sleep quietly in the same room all night without problems, so all is not bad.

About the walks, Nikita does her thing and ignores him. Ivan, whines if she and my husband get too far ahead of him, but I am holding him back so he has to accept that I will control the walk, and they are getting seperate walks and outdoor time (I don't think he has had a yard, he doesn't know what to do outside).

As for his training, I think he has had some (it is coming back to him). I am starting with a clicker and reading more about NILIF. I do not want to push too hard at first since I have no idea of his history, I don't think he was abused, he is fearless, not afraid of the vaccum, bikes, cars, etc., but is a bit underweight. But still, I don't know what his former environment was like and do want him to be more comfortable with his new family. Thanks again for any and all advice, it is very helpful and reassuring. :D :p

[Nikki Jackson]

what Deb said goes for me too! there is a pecking order
and ur older dog is trying to keep things in line. This usually means
that the owners are not, not blaming. make sure ur older dog gets
everything first, new dog 2nd after all he was there 1st.

[Melissa Brunoehler]

Hi All~

There is absolutely no reason that Nikita should get everything first.
Whichever dog performs the desired behavior(sit,down,et c.) first is the one that gets the desired item (pet, treat,etc.) first.


what Deb said goes for me too! there is a pecking order
and ur older dog is trying to keep things in line. This usually means
that the owners are not, not blaming. make sure ur older dog gets
everything first, new dog 2nd after all he was there 1st.

[Renee]

When people "support" one dog over another, this is often times how people create bullies and escalate tension with their resident canines.