Are we in the wrong class?

[Ann Albers]

Rudy and I started our first Basic I obedience class today. We took a Puppy K class in January and February at the same dog training club and had a marvelous time. Today was a bit different. First, the instructor walked around the ring to check out our collars. Rudy had a regular collar and leash. She informed me that he needed a choke collar. (There were no choke collars in Puppy K). Soon after that, some dogs in the facility started barking. Rudy replied with a few barks. Another dog in class barked and again he replied. The instructor's assistant came up and told me she was going to spray his mouth with a lemon juice/water mix when he barked. All the while, the instructor is instructing (I was not able to concentrate so who knows what she said) and Rudy was confused... thinking "puppies to play with!!- yeah! but why am I getting squirted and now you want me to sit and stay??" I did feel that we were a bit behind in our training- Rudy's stays were very short while many of the other dogs would stay all day. The instructor seemed to expect the dogs to sit for minutes at a time while she talked. Rudy is not doing that yet- especiallly with the distraction of all of the dogs (he's an only dog).

So, am I in the wrong class? Should I give it another week? Should I say no to the lemon juice/water and choke collar? Is it unreasonable for a dog to bark in reply or to communicate in that way during a class?

There was another dog that was very disruptive in class but he was not sprayed with anything. His owner was having trouble controlling him because of his size and the instructor spent time with that which lead Rudy to get up from his stay- (we were next that dog.)

[heathea]

uh, sounds like a bad class to me.
I would definatley say no to any spraying. that is just not a good thing. Choke chains are also very damaging when used incorrectly. ugh, get out of there and get your money back. It sounds like too big of a class as well, maybe look for a one on one trainer, I found that to be well worth the money (back in the day).
Just my 2 cents.
Good luck, and trust you inner voice that makes you question this crappy teacher.
-Heather

[Mario Niepel]

Yup, wrong class. Choke collars and spraying in response to barking on leash is the first step on a very short road that very often ends in a leash-aggressive dog. Do what you think is right. If you think it is confusing to your pup, then it most likely is.

[Sheryl]

I know I am responding a bit late, but I agree that you should find a different class.
What did you decide to do?

[Eric Vecc]

I got myself in a similar situation. The class description said to bring a choke collar, so I called the instructor. She said she does not require choke chains, just a collar that WILL NOT come off my dogs head (the class is outside). Sounds reasonable! But when we got there, I learned that she does use leash correction. Almost everyone there had coke chains (because of the class description) and when these dogs (all 20 of them) all got corrected, it sounded HORRIBLE. Bailey DOES NOT get corrected with a yank on his leash. Anyway, we stayed in the class for a few weeks for the socialization but eventually stopped going because the cruelty to these dogs was hard to watch. I kept Bailey on a harness while doing the Heel command and she even said to me, "you need a different collar, he won't feel anything when you yank on that!". In my first display of rebellion, I replied, "I'm sorry but I don't want my dog to feel anything but happy when he is practicing a command". And I treated him as we walked. I also saw her teaching a dog how to sit and told the owner to PUSH the dog's butt down until she sits. I saw her trying this and went over and put a treat above the dogs head and she sat right down. Then I put the treat between his legs and pulled it away, and she layed down. The owner was amazed and I saw her doing it throughout the rest of the class.

It was only $35 for this class but the bigger damage is 20 new dog owners all training their dogs the wrong way and the dog's are ther ones suffering.

[Stefie C]

LOL, Eric, Sounds to me like you should be teaching the class! I bet that trainer was really glad you dropped out! :D

Ann, I agree. Bad class. Bad trainer. Get your money back if you can. If not take the loss rather than let them near your dog. This is exactly the reason I haven't taken Sandy to an obedience class. Before signing up for another class, be sure & talk with the trainer and be sure your going to be comfortable with their methods. I learned to do this the hard way too. Good Luck.

[Alberta Hanko]

Hi Ann - I picked up on this one late also--but am just answering because my Linus is the perfect sad example (exactly as Mario stated) of what happens in a class that uses leash pops and sprays to correct the pups. Linus was 5 months when we began that class. This all happened three years ago--and I am still working with his leash aggression issues using positive reinforcement now. So get out of that class for sure.

Alberta & Linus

[Ann Albers]

We are still in the class as of now. Yesterday was the second class. I bought the choke collar but do not yank on it (leash pops). It actually stays looser than a regular collar while we are walking around the ring and performing commands. The spray bottle did not come out again. If it did I would refuse to let it be used. Rudy is enjoying the socialization so we will stay with it for now.

Thanks for your support. We'll see how it goes but this will be our last session at this facility regardless.

[Mario Niepel]

Ann, I understand your decision to stay in the class for now. I think it is great that you are not using the choke collar for 'leash pops'. Unfortunately, leash pops are not the only way a choke collar can hurt your dog. Especially if your dog is very hyper, likes to pull, has the propensity to chase after squirrels or desperately wants to greet people or dogs then the dog itself can inflict damage or injury to the trachea. Since excited dogs are extremely pain tolerant, the pain and injury will not automatically prevent your dog from continuing these behaviors.