fruits and veggies for doggies??

[Mickelle Weber]

OK all,
Cleo wants everything and anything we eat...are there things that we simply shouldn't feed her(other than chocolate) she just loves oranges and apples(obviously we only give her small tastes) and we never feed her when we are eating a meal(we want a good mannered doggie) but she just sits and gives us puppy dog eyes and i guess my rational has been "hey humans need a variety why not dogs??" thanks in advance for any suggestions/advice!

[Peggy Jensen]

I know you should never feed a dog onions, and be careful with apples that they don't get the seeds, the only other thing I know they absolutely should not have is macadamia nuts. I'm sure some others have more to add to the list.

[Jody Hayes]

Grapes and raisins are a no-no too. they can make them very sick.

[Eric Vecc]

Carrots are good but too many is bad. This is a great topic and I hope someone comes up with a list. I have heard yams are good to feed to dog's - fun and good for them.

[Rachel]

broccoli, cabbage, leafy green vegetables are good if you can get them to eat it. Sophie liked to pick up the lettuce, carry it around, and then drop it but she will not eat it. I heard bananas are good too. Apples and carrots are always good and easy to feed them.

Rachel

[Grace Erick]

I found this info on the internet. Susan from the old DD did say nightshade veggies are not good though there are potatoes in so many foods as well as tomato pomace and peppers and garlic too now that I think about it:


Stay away from nightshade vegetables as some say they can cause skin problems and small sores in and around the mouth area.

Nightshade vegetables have been known to aggravate gastrointestinal problems, increase intestinal gas (like we need more of this), and cause indigestion.

Nightshade vegetables may also be a factor in arthritis, stiff legs, and in calcium problems.

Members of the nightshade family include:

eggplants
green peppers
potatoes
onions (toxic to dogs and cats)
chives (toxic to dogs and cats)
garlic (toxic to dogs and cats)
tomatoes

[Grace Erick]

Another site about feeding homemade foods said:

Virtually all vegetables are acceptable, although favorites include carrots, broccoli, cauliflower, yellow squash, zucchini and Brussels sprouts.




The key word here is "vitually", so which are the bad veggies. It didn't make sense the site didn't mention them.

Bye, Grace

[Grace Erick]

From another site, veggies that are good:


Veggies : any and all (except the ones listed at the end from the nightshade family)
(I mostly use: carrots [vits], green beans [for weight loss], beets [liver support], alfalfa sprouts [for joint care], potatoes [always cooked], yams [always cooked], peas, cauliflower, broccoli, squashes, and sometimes pink beans)

I thought beets were no good because they have sugar in them? Then they say nightshade veggies are no good, but I think there is a clause about them that is left out on most sites where potatoes are okay if they are white and veggies and fruits are okay if they are not unripe. Peas, they are only good if they are pureed, because we all know they will pass right through with no purpose, but home made diets do say to puree veggies and fruit. I read beans are not digestible, but don't even know what a pink bean is anyway.

[Grace Erick]

I read avocado was good, then I read it was bad. Then I read it's only the pit and leaves that are bad. Avocado is in Avoderm canned food.

[Liz Gilbert]

So, bananas are good?

We've given cocoa a few small pieces of our bananas this week. He seemed to like them :)

Liz

[Peggy Jensen]

I know I have been askinga lot of kind of stupid questions lately, but I am a fairly new doggie Mom and have not much experience.
All the lists say onions and garlic are toxic to dogs, but there are all kinds of recipes for dog treats that have garlic powder in them, so is it only raw onion and garlic, also I have heard to make treats my super cooking sliced hot dogs so they are really dried out and most of those have onion and/or garlic in them.
I get confused!!!!!

[Chris Smith]

Grace,

Your posting said that potatoes and yams should always be cooked. Is that really true? Why? Is it harmful to give them raw?

I have given Nalu the following veggies/fruits: carrots, yams, cucumber, celery, apples, pears (all raw). And cooked corn, peas, green beans and carrots.

The only thing he didn't eat was the celery stalk.

[Andre Mendizabal]

yeah Chris, you should cook them all the time, feeding them raw is not a good idea. You can give veggies and fruits but in small amounts, a large amount of those can produce runny stools... if you want to give some variety to your dogs meal, I would suggest serving a "dressing" with their kibble, that "dressing" may consist in cooked or raw meat, veggies, yogurt (not too often), brown rice, eggs (not too often), raw bones, or a combination of any... Just avoid all the foods everybody already mentioned here. About Nalu giving you sad puppy eyes at the table, either just ignore it or do as I do and take him to another room. I usually take them to the backyard and give them each a kong or a treat ball, that way they will be busy while I'm eating and don't have to put up with the puppy look that makes me feel so guilty

[Jo Russell]

Here is something specific about onion toxicity http://www.aspca.org/site/DocServer/vettech_0801.pdf?doc ID=349

It seems that onion can be a problem in quantities in excess of 0.5% of bodyweight, that's half of 1% of the dogs weight, NOT half of a dogs whole bodyweight.

I don't feed onion and honestly can't think of any good reason why I would. However I do feed a plate of vege's to my two every 10 days or so in place of their daily raw meat meal - mine have some kibble (Nutro) each day too. Usually the vege meal is plain mashed potato, pumpkin and/or some other root vegetable, like carrot and a little of whatever greens I have on hand.

Cooking veges for dogs helps to break down the cellulose which binds the veg... apparently a dog's system can't do that with raw, whole veg, which is why you can see whole peas and chunks of carrot, for instance, come out the other end unless you cook or even thrash it/them up a bit in a food processor. I think it's generally agreed that not more than 10% vegetables and less fruit is an appropriate amount as part of a raw/natural diet for dogs, if they're given at all.

Grace, I too thought the nightshade family would be an absolute no-no. But it seems like if the dog doesn't have a condition which might be aggravated by them, or a hereditary inclination to such a disease by breed or family then some will not hurt. I would not feed the leaves or stems, ever. of potatoes or tomatoes That's definitely a no-no, but I think most of us aware of the toxicity of these parts of those plants for humans.. like how green patches on the skin of a potato is bad and most of us would automatically extrapolate that knowledge to our dogs, I think.

I peel the potatoes always for the dogs and have given, rarely, really small amounts (less than an inch square) of raw tomato and green pepper - also known as bell pepper or capsicum, right? I think we're talking about the same thing there. Sometimes I just give the dogs a piece of some of the things I'm preparing for the guinea pigs who need lots of vit C rich and green things. I don't think there's much, if any harm in doing that.

I have heard of a little tomato sauce (without too much in the way of additives) or tomato juice being given to help prevent brown pee patches in the lawn... it does something to alter the acidity/alkalinity balance of the urine.

Getting back to the onion family, a few times a week I crush a clove of garlic (just the one shared proportionally between both my dogs) into their "raw" meal, sometimes that will be the cooked veg. In smaller doses like this it has therapuetic value - good for the immune system, deters fleas and may help to prevent overinfestation of worms - while it doesn't kill worms it acts in some way to prevent them attaching to the stomach wall, I've heard. It's possible for a particular dog to not tolerate garlic well, maybe a bit of an upset tummy, but I believe it to be generally safe and beneficial in small amounts. This is the only supplement I use, except for adding some dried, ground-to-a-powder eggshell as a calc/phos supp. if I'm giving more mince and/or organ meat than actual bone in any given week or so.

I don't, of course, give grapes (I think it's the seeds that are the potential problem) or raisins or chocolate, though it is possible for dogs to ingest a small amount of these things, as has been known to happen accidentally, without them becoming mortally ill. Apart from that, I think common sense is a good guide and the old maxim "If in doubt, don't" is worth remembering.

[Rowena Fry]

I found the following information from a site after doing a quick yahoo search.

Known Food Toxins To Dogs
Fruits, Vegetables, Food

Apple, Almond, Apricot, Peach, Wild Cherries, Plum, Balsam Pear, Prunes and similar fruit: Diarrhea, vomiting, abdominal pain, (Stem, Seeds and Leaves) The seeds of most fruits contain cyanide, which is poisonous to dogs as well as humans. (I'm not sure about the other fruit on this list, but I remember someone saying on DD that the 'meat' and skin of apples is fine, it's just the seeds that are bad because they contain cyanide. - Rowena)

Avocados: The fruit, pit and plant are all toxic. They can cause difficulty breathing and fluid accumulation in the chest, abdomen and heart

Broccoli: reported to be pretty potent gastrointestinal irritant

Cherry: rapid breathing, shock, mouth inflammation, heart rate increase

Chocolate: seizures, coma, hyperactivity, rapid heart beat, tremors, death. Bakers chocolate is the most dangerous. A dog can consume milk chocolate and appear to be fine because it is not as concentrated but is still very dangerous.
• 1 oz per lb of body weight for (2 oz per kg) of body weight for bakers chocolate
• 1 oz per 3 lbs of body weight (1 oz per 1.5 kg body weight) for semi-sweet chocolate
• 1 oz per 9lbs of body weight (1 oz per 4 kg) for bakers chocolate
• Please keep in mind that these are only guidelines, and if you suspect your pet had ingested chocolate, please keep an eye out for ANY signs of poisoning! Every dog reacts differently to quantity.
Coffee/Tea: Drinks/Foods: containing caffeine or sugar may cause many of the same symptoms chocolate causes

Cooked Bones: uncooked bones should be safe but if they are cooked you should refrain because they deteriorate and easily splinter. Can cause extensive damage to internal organs and passage ways, may times resulting in death.

Mushrooms: acute gastric effects, liver and kidney damage, abdominal pain, nausea, salivation, vomiting

Nutmeg: tremors, seizures and death

Tobacco: nausea, salivation, vomiting, tachycardia (rapid heartbeat)

Onion: (cats are more sensitive), gastrointestinal upset, hemolytic anemia, heinz body anemia, hemogloinria, destroys red blood cells

Grapes, Raisins, Prunes: kidney failure, as little as a single serving of grapes or raisins can kill a dog. It takes anywhere from 9 oz to 2 lbs of grapes and raisins (between .041 and 1.1 oz/kg of body weight), to cause severe vomiting and diarrhea, and possible kidney failure

Salt: excessive intake can cause kidney problems

Raw Eggs- many people feed raw eggs to their dogs but keep in mind that they can contain salmonella. Dogs do have a higher immunity against salmonella poisoning but are not immune and have been reported to get it from uncooked eggs. (This is an ongoing debate though, some say raw, some say cooked - Rowena)

Macadamia Nuts - This isn't on this list but I know they are very harmful to dogs.

Tomatoes - Although they are of the nightshade family, the fruit itself is actually okay to feed to dogs. It's the plant, stem and leaves, that contains the toxicity. I'm not sure if that goes for green tomatoes as well, but I wouldn't risk it.



Actually, this site is pretty good, has a massive list of plants/houseplants that are potential hazards. This is the link: http://www.acreaturecomfort .com/toxic.htm

I have also read on a few raw food sites that vegetables are good for dogs, as long as you've broken down the cell walls by either shreadding or cooking the veges first. Dogs don't have the capacity to digest raw vegetables, so there isn't any nutritional value in feeding them raw. But I have given raw bits of carrot to Gum Gum as treats, simply for her to play around with and chew on and it doesn't do her any harm. They don't benefit her nutritionally but she enjoys them, and it doesn't affect her stools in any way.

I actually have another list I compiled and printed out, but it's at home. It was from a thread back on DD. I'll try to remember to get it out and type it up.

Hope this helped!

[Grace Erick]

Chris, I think the raw potatoes just need to be cooked because they may be hard to digest raw, but they may not be actually "harmful", but could maybe cause gas or gastric distress. I did a google search for "dog vegetables" to come of with the stuff I found. I think sometimes you need to find 5 sources that all say the same thing before you can believe it!!!

Jo, the jury is still out about what causes dogs to get ill from grapes and raisons, but you may very well be right by thinking it's because of the seeds since some seeds can make dogs ill. That capsicum thing, I'm unsure about that. I have a link that calls it pepper, but I'm not sure if it is one particular type of pepper or just a general term for pepper. I did find that green peppers were not good, but also like you say there can be a clause about the flesh being good but the seeds being bad, but they lump the entire veggie into one category and call it bad like saying potatoes are not good when maybe it's just the green part. I find potatoes in lots of premium foods like Natural Balance and ultra premium Merrick's Grammy's Pot Pie, so go figure!!!

If it's jarred tomato sauce, it will have a lot of onion in it and possibly garlic, so be careful with tomato sauce unless you make it yourself and leave these items out. I see tomato is not good, but some foods have tomato pomace and I think Natural Balance is one food that it's in. Who knows, again, maybe it's just part of the tomato that is not good. You usually don't see tomato in food so I'm suspicious of it, but you don't see a lot of veggies like broccoli in food which is supposed to be so good. Potatoes and carrots are cheaper veggies to put in food, so maybe that's why we see them and they are used so that dog owners see them in the food and feel better that they see something that they can identify, so it can be a consumer gimmick to show the potatoes and carrots where there is no reason not to puree it into the food which would probably be better!

Don't raw foods have uncooked veggies? But they are probably pureed in them for better digestion and vitamin absorption.

[Rowena Fry]

Jo,
I have read the same thing about garlic being highly beneficial to dogs, in small doses. Yeah, something about being a natural flea deterrant. I have put a bit of crushed garlic in my pup's food in the past and she absolutely LOVES it! And she doesn't get garlic breath from it either! :p

[Jo Russell]

Thanks for that, Rowena. Oh, about eggs, apart from the powdered shell I mentioned in my last post, I have given insides of an egg raw from time to time, but have lately switched to lightly scrambling it when I do give it to the dogs.

[Grace Erick]

Ooops, I forgot to post my link to herbs. It mentions garlic and peppers and says garlic is good!

http://www.lowchensaustrali a.com/health/herbs.htm

I'm leary of some herbs like that Kava Kava stuff from years ago which was an herb of sorts. It was a root or you used the root for a calming effect on people and now it is found out to be unsafe. I even found it was used for dogs in a dog book dated back to 1947. It had a new copyright date, so you would think it was a new book, but then I looked at the bottom of the page and saw it was old with some updated info, but the author did not take out the part that Kava was still good.

Bye, Grace

[Jo Russell]

Talk about a flurry of posts!

We don't get garlic breath here, either, Rowena.

And Grace, I think you're right in wondering whether or not some people write off a particular veg/food altogether because there is a part of it that can be a problem. Maybe it seems safer to do that sometimes, rather than risk that inevitable one person who doesn't think or research well who seriously hurts or even kills their animal.... I don't know? Just thinking out loud...

[Casey Laurie]

I know you should never feed a dog onions, and be careful with apples that they don't get the seeds, the only other thing I know they absolutely should not have is macadamia nuts. I'm sure some others have more to add to the list.

No macadamia nuts? It's a good thing I read this then. I've been using cashews as super reinforcers for reconditioning and they are mixed with macadamias.
Hmm..I know peanuts are safe. I'll go get a jar of those to use instead. Thanks for posting this. What happens when they eat macadamias?

[Krysta Smith]

Macadamia nuts can cause rear leg weakness. It happened to Lola about a month after I got her. We had a container of mixed nuts that spilled behind a cabinet and she got a holld of some. She was limping for about two days, but I just figured she'd hurt her leg jumping off of something. Now I know better though!!

[Grace Erick]

Jo, it's like I read avocados are bad, then I read it's just the stems and leaves. I know Avoderm used avocado in their canned food.

[Jo Russell]

Yes, I give the guinea's and dogs a little avacado flesh, a heaped teaspoon or so, if I have it in. It's kind of a treat for us, even for me... I'm quite fascinated by some of the foods you have available commercially in the US for dogs. We don't have anything like the variety of processed foods you do yet. I'm certainly not seeing the high end stuff, like the canned items you give your Chi, Grace.

It's occurred to me that I might be making a bit of an *** of myself with assumptions I make based on the sort of knowledge I (as an old hick from hicksville!) think of as common knowledge about foods, like that green bits on and of potato are bad. I apologise if I've offended anybody who didn't know these sorts of things because they simply grew up in a different way.

About Macadamia's. Yes, too much of them can cause weakness, muscle tremors, even paralysis. From everything I've read, and like Krysta observed, it does seem to clear the system in about 48 hrs. They (the people who look into these things) can't identify the mechanism which causes the toxicosis, nor have they been able to establish exactly how much is too much, so although it may seem fine, causing no prob's as a treat in some cases, like Casey has found, they're probably best avoided altogether.

Peggy, you were talking about supercooked hot dog as treats... Personally, I would be wary of processed meats like this. While I don't think you can kill your dog using a little in this way, I do know that they're not a very healthy food, even for humans because of the preservatives (is it nitrites or nitrates?) that are usually in them.. not to mention the generally poor quality of the "meat" component of this type of food.

For training treats I use dried liver. I buy small packages from a pet supply store and cut it up into really tiny bits. The dogs love it and it's good for them. (Of course, if I were a purist, I would be buying organic liver and drying it out myself ;) ).

[Grace Erick]

Hi Jo, I looked up your bio to see you are in New Zealand. From the little I've seen of it on tv, it looks beautiful there!!!! There is a place in NY that is actually called Hicksville, lol!!!

I think any info a person imparts that will help them not to kill their dog with kindness (bad treats or food) is always welcome. I just noticed these treats made by the Milk Bone co. that I used to feed Capri before I found natural chicken jerky, has sodium nitrate in it which is in frankfuter, bacon, ham, bologna etc. and that is a cancerous preservative but says it's used in these treats for color retention. I noticed it in Pedigree soft pouch food too, but if you call the company, they will most likely say it's not in the food enough to cause harm, but you feed that plus other snacks with sodium nitrate and who can say how much they are ingesting?

I just noticed what Rowena posted about avocado being bad. The site that I saw it was bad on had a phone number to call, so I did and asked if it's poisonous, why do I see it in dog food. The guy said there were two cases of two dogs in Africa that ate a ton of avocados in one day and were sick to begin with that died. Also apples are mentioned and they are in dog food too, so it may be, again, just the seeds, but for whatever reason, the whole fruit gets posted as being bad.

Rowena, I read that all unripe fruit is not good including unripe tomatoes.

[Chris Smith]

Thanks for the all of the fruit and veggie info. Almost all the time Nalu gets his veggies raw. And I leave the skin on the raw yams. I thought the skin had the most vitamins in it.

I guess I'll start changing up what I do...and hopefully he'll get more nutritional value and less hard veggie pieces in his poop!!

[Grace Erick]

Chris, I don't see why a dog cannot have skin on their potatoes except it may be harder to digest and not really give them the extra vitamins the skin does have. I think what you would have to do is puree the skin with the potato. Dog food books on homecooking say to puree veggies and fruits for better absorption.

I see pieces of potato and carrot in Natural Balance (canned) and other foods, but it may be there to make the owner happy that they seem them, because I see no reason for the company not to puree them into the food along with everything else.

Bye, Grace

[Rowena Fry]

Sorry this took me so long to finally dig out and type up. I can't remember what sites I found this information from, so sorry, no links. I think I may have just done a couple of online searches and compiled all the info to print out. The stuff at the bottom is from a raw food website, which is why it's divided into food groups. Anyway, here we go!

Toxic foods and their effects

Chocolate/cocoa - staggering, laboured breathing, vomiting, diarrhea, abdominal pain, tremors, fever, increased heart rate, arrythmia, seizures, coma, death. Baker's chocolate is the most dangerous. A dog can consume milk chocolate and appear to be fine because it is not as concentrated, but it is still dangerous.

Coffee/ coffee grounds/ tea/ tea bags - staggering, laboured breathing, vomiting, diarrhea, abdominal pain, tremors, fever, increased heart rate, arrythmia, seizures, coma, death. Drinks and foods containing caffeine cause many of the same symptoms chocolate causes.

Onions - hemolytic anemia, laboured breathing, liver damage, vomiting, diarrhea, discoloured urine. Onions destroy red blood cells and can cause anemia.

Mushrooms - abdominal pain, drooling, liver damage, vomiting, diarrhea, convulsions, coma, death.

Grapes/ raisins - vomiting, diarrhea, abdominal pain, lethargy, kidney failure. As little as a single serving of raisins can kill a dog.

Macadamia nuts - Macadamia nuts cause weakness, muscle tremor and paralysis. Limit all other nuts as they are not good for dogs in general, their high phosphorous content is said to possibly lead to bladder stones. EXCEPTION to this rule is PEANUTS and PEANUT BUTTER. However, always use salt/sugar free peanut butter (sugar encourages cancer growth). Also use organic peanut butter as regular peanut butter has lots of toxins.

Animal fat and fried foods - Excessive dat can cause pancreatitis.

Tomato plant - Tomatoes can cause tremors and heart arrhthmias. Tomato stems, leaves and the plant itself are toxic, however the fruit is not.

Avocados - The fruit, pit and plant are all toxic. They can cause difficulty breathing and fliud accumulation in the chest, abdomen and heart.

Nutmeg - Nutmeg can cause tremors, seizures and death.

Apples/ Cherries/ Peaches and similar fruit - The SEEDS of these fruits contain cyanide, which is poisonous to dogs as well as humans. A core or pit can also become lodged in the intestines and kill a dog in 24 hours with no warning.

Salt - Excessive salt intake can cause kidney problems.

Raw eggs - Raw eggs can cause salmonella poisoning in dogs. (Again I'm not sure about this. Some people believe eggs should be given raw, some people cooked.)


Food that dogs CAN eat

Protein
- Meats should be boneless and it's best if the skin is removed.
- Beef
- Chicken
- Turkey
- Lamb
- Pork
- Fish (although limit tuna and swordfish due to high mercury content)
- Cottage cheese
- Yoghurt
- Eggs
- Beans
- Walnuts (in moderation)
- Sunflower seeds (in moderation)
- Soy foods
- Liver

Vegetables
- Dogs have shorter digestive tracts than humans and cannot digest most vegetables whole or in large chunks. It's best to put them through a food processor, shredding them, or cooking them before giving them to your dog.
- Carrots
- Green beans
- Lettuce
- Potatoes
- Yams
- Asparagus
- Broccoli
- Brussel sprouts
- Cabbage
- Celery
- Peas
- Peppers (sweet)
- Spinach
- Squash
- Turnip
- Pumpkin and pumpkin puree (good for diarrhea and constipation in dogs)
- Kale
- Okra/ Ladies Fingers (although this gave Gum Gum diarrhea...maybe cos she's only little though)
- Cilantro
- Beet
- Lima beans
- Garlic

Carbohydrates
- Sweet potato
- Pasta
- Brown rice
- Millet
- Buckwheat
- Quinoa
- Barley
- Tapioca
- Polenta

Fats
- Olive oil
- Sunflower oil
- Fish oil
- Add up to 1 tsp of oil per 20lbs bodyweight.
- Butter
- Cream cheese


Sorry about any typos! Hope it's helpful!

[Grace Erick]

Hi Rowena,

Thanks for finding that information about good foods for our dogs. That is just what I was looking for. I'm going to paste it onto an e-mail and put it in storage in my mail:)

I'm not sure how I feel about butter. I remember making that in school from heavy cream which is not good for dogs and I'm not sure what's in cream cheese. Isn't that whole milk? I don't know if whole milk is very good because of lactose and heavy cream is bad. I know, my dog had a little (heavy cream) unbeknownst to me in mashed potatoes and she got the runs from it.

Bye, Grace

[Grace Erick]

I read two dogs in Africa died from avocados. Then I called the poison site the avocados were on and they said the dogs were sick already and ate many avocados which means the poisonous parts, so I'm not sure avocado meat is bad. It's in Avoderm canned food.

Bye, Grace

[aussiesmum]

rowena, great list! The only point of issue I see is the avacado debate. on DD susan said the avadado meat is ok, not the stems or leaves and the pit is a no no... as already pointed out avoderm is a food specificaly made with avadacos... so I think they are ok (the meat of the fruit anyway)

Cashew nuts are ok. I think garlic is supposed to be used in moderation...

[Chris Smith]

Rowena,

Thanks for putting together such a great and useful food list for all of us!!

Chris

[Rowena Fry]

No probs guys, like I said, I did it for myself just after we got Gum Gum, so I thought I'd share. I compiled a huge Dog File with loads of information about dog behaviour, training, nutrition, recipes, NILIF, stuff like that. Mostly from articles I found online. I'm such a geek! But I'm glad you find the info useful!

Grace, I know what you mean about the butter. I wouldn't give my pup butter, I don't even eat the stuff myself! And low fat cream cheese should be okay, like Philadephia Light or something similar, cos it's made with nonfat milk.

Lorie, I've heard the same thing about the meat of the avocado being okay for dogs. And Jo Russell said she gives her dog avocado. I think it's more of a cautionary entry, so people don't give the pit or any other part of the avocado to their dog, the same as I've seen some sites that say tomatoes are a big no no when it's actually the plant, stem and leaves that's dangerous.